Change Your World-NOT your Body

Saturday, November 12, 2011

Off Topic Comments

This space is for comments that wind up off topic. Feel free to bring the discussion for other disorders that also affect the trans disorder here.

dirt

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37 comments:

  1. Here's a group that is showing it's fine Trans disorder and co-opting another. https://www.youtube.com/user/TransInsight

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  2. Interesting video.. I like the passion. There is alot of power in being true to yourself, whatever that may be. We are all on a journey in this world to discover just that, peace.

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  3. I think that there are many disorders that get misdiagnosed as Transsexuality (basically, many of the personality disorders, examples being the Borderline Personality Disorder, the Narcistic Personality Disorder, the Histrionic Personality Disorder or the many times argued Dissociative Personality Disorder; and other Disorders like Body Dismorphic Disorder, or also anything that has delusion as one of the symptoms).

    I also think that interpretation of these disorders as transsexualism and physical transition of the sufferers somehow reminds of the mysogynistic treatment of hysteria (haha, removal of the uterus being just an example) in the last 1-2 centuries.

    Maybe even the much too rushed diagnosis of a disorder like BPD (of which most sufferers are female), and expecially a misuse of this diagnosis as commonplace by laymen, are another attempt to "other" and "demonize" females.

    But sadly, silly me already said most of what I wanted to say about it in the other post even though it was off-topic =/

    It is so difficult to stay on-topic because the things you say here, Dirt, evoke so many thoughts in my head in response... I am sorry for that.

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  4. Gotta love it when people who know absolutely nothing about transsexualism feel the need to "explain" it, demonstrating their own ignorance.

    It's even funnier when lay people try to second guess mental health professionals.

    I guess what really pisses off radfems is that transsexual people are evidence that "gender" is more than something men made up just to keep women under their thumb.

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  5. LOL Anon at 6:46, do you even know what you are talking about? You think all mental health professionals are always right? Then don't you dare to "second guess" me, because I am one. See how absurd your assumption is?

    Discussion involves rethinking and bringing into a new context things that people might see as obvious or given otherwise. I am not preaching an absolute truth, just suggesting non-mainstream ideas. I think medicine, psychiatry and psychology have to be very careful with giving someone a diagnosis, expecially such an "in" diagnosis like "transsexuality", "BPD", or "DID".

    If you want to believe your "evidence", then continue to do so. But maybe you could remember that even "mental health professionals" have to continue learning all the time, and that all evidence is not final. This is how science works.

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  6. Way to go all you trans-guys! Oh Yeah I get it...You really are men. The manliest of manly men cause you get to wear boots and flannel! Except you really don't want to ~be~ men cause that would mean not being women any more and you don't want to leave the lesbian community, and you don't want any surgery other than a mastectomy, no it is not "top surgery" it is a mastectomy. And you really don't want THAT surgery cause real men. According to the trans-dogma don't really need a dick to be men and you may still want to have a baby at some point despite the fact that the men born MEN cannot have babies! They don't want to have babies, and they would sooner die than to be one minute without their precious dicks! Which is why they will sit on their helmet in a war rather than risk injury to their beloved jewels!

    Then there is that whole thing about how T makes you feel weird after the rush subsides! How it messes up the way you think, you loose your pretty hair and you get horrible acne and if you are young enough you can even get a nice set of brow ridges with that facial hair that will never go away to go with those baby making hips that no man has! Of course none of you really like being around real men cause they scare the shit out of you because men are violent! They cuss and they fight and they threaten and you haven't a clue how to even start to do the male dominance dance that every male on the planet does when in the presence of another male. You for sure don't have a clue what to do with your "male privilege" and it even makes you uncomfortable that the privilege is handed to you as privilege always is, and worse of all? All those straight women out there really really scare you cause they have very real expectations about relations with men that you will not and cannot deliver!
    But God forbid any one point any of this out! Oh No...that doesn't mean you might need to rethink what you think you are, Easier to say that it means that we who point out that the sun comes up on the east are a bunch of binary worshiping transphobes because you cannot even begin to cut it as your "target sex..."

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  7. ^
    What an ignorant moron.

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  8. anon 2:43

    What's wrong? Can't get a girl friend? Someone sounds a little bitter.

    That entire rant was laughable. Go to school you half-witted degenerate.

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  9. LOL @ 2:43.... angry much? I, too found that rant quite amusing.

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  10. I thought about adding to this madness, thought better of it, and deleted my comment!

    But something about the direction this seemed to be taking really bugged me so I came back for another go at making a comment.

    While I too think Anon, 2:43 was way over the top, and quite possibly rabid! Isn't her premise basically correct?

    I mean isn't there a contradiction between those who are all about being "men" but who refuse to leave the safety of the lesbian community or the shelter of being among women? Doesn't that action alone say way more than the words about true motives?

    Signed, Curious and Confused

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  11. @ Anon @2:43 PM...

    Take some Midol!

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  12. I think 2:43's post was while overly enthusiastic was pretty much right on. And the 'take some Midol' comment is pretty much sexist.

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  13. To extrospection-

    If it was true that you did leave the lesbian community, why oh why do I continue to see your postings here again and again?!

    talk about obsessed.

    go be a man then. and leave this lesbian blog be. or can you even do that?!?!

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  14. I don't know what to think anymore...To each his/her ownNovember 14, 2011 at 12:05 PM

    I try really hard to understand trans individuals and the whole community but so many questions come up when doing so...

    Who, What, Where, When and How...

    First and foremost I respect all who respect me - Nothing more, Nothing less...I just want those who are planning to transition to really do some REAL SOUL SEARCHING before making the decision - Make sure this is what you want to do...ITS NOT A GAME - THIS IS YOUR LIFE!
    because believe it or not there are individuals who are doing this for fun!

    if anyone is familiar with the Ball Scene and houses (i.e House of Balenciaga,House of Prada, House of Monroe, House of Prodigy etc) there are individuals who Transition just to be in a house and to win "Tans-man realness"
    This was told to me from a FTM who participates in the ball scene regularly

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  15. Yeah, no, totally, The sun does come up in the east. Let's address another truth:

    Most people who are *that* angry at transmen wanted to transition but had to reject the idea because *their* bodies would never pass as male even after T and surgery. I hate to bring up such a touchy subject but it does happen and I feel really, really bad for those people. The above angry poster is likely in this category. Certain people are obviously too short, too small in stature, too wide in the hips or just generally very female and curvy. This can be a huge source of grief for people, and we all know that rage is easier to feel than grief. Get some therapy because your anger will kill you.

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  16. "the sun comes up in the east" Is actually a good metaphor for the "facts" brought up in the blog and by its readers. Because although the sun does seem to rise in the east and we can test this by looking outside every morning, when u look at the bigger picture, the world does in fact revolve around the sun, and the sun doesn't rise at all.

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  17. I don't have a problem with what people decide to do with their bodies/ how they identify etc. Like the commentor above, I respect those who respect me. But at the same time I feel vexed at times that so many transmen seem to perpetuate mysogyny and sexism when they talk about their bodies/identities.

    There are tons of women out there who like wearing "mens" clothes, doing "boy" things, having/fantasize about having sex "like a man" and have experienced dysphoria (I don't like using male terms btw, just don't know how to explain it better?)

    I know that not all transmen discuss/understand their experiences in these ways, but i do get annoyed that the trans lobby appears to have claimed these experiences as distinctive. I'm just reflecting on what i've seen and heard in my own social circle/ read in zines/blogs/literature.

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  18. to 5:51,
    no way, i see SO many trans'men' who are tiny and wide-hipped- i almost think women with the LEAST masculine bodies transition to male more often than people with more androgynous natural looks- the same way so many male-to-females remain towering masculine types with adam's apples dressed in tootsie-attire

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  19. "Gotta love it when people who know absolutely nothing about transsexualism feel the need to "explain" it, demonstrating their own ignorance.

    It's even funnier when lay people try to second guess mental health professionals.
    "

    God, this WORSHIP of mental health professionals, when they themselves admit they have no real IDEA where this supposedly innate gender comes from!

    I guess they're just valid objects of worship at the moment since they are the gatekeepers for access to the magical T and magical surgery, hence shall not be disagreed with.............

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  20. Anon 8:54 - I come here for the young trans people in the trender posts, who come here upset over having been humiliated by all of you, so that they have the support of someone from the Trans community, and for the people who come here that are on the fence so that they have information from both sides. A lot of the claims that are made here are completely false or blanket generalizations.. and for those who don't know any better, if that mis-information goes uncontested then they take ignorant statements as fact.

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  21. "...the world does in fact revolve around the sun, and the sun doesn't rise at all."

    Now that you mention the SCIENTIFIC background of the sunrise, Anon at 6:37 PM... The idea that the sun revolves around the earth used to be scientific mainstream by the way (and people who said otherwise were like, KILLED by the inquisition). Just what tells anyone that the scientific mainstream of today - trans trending and all included - is more correct than the idea of the sun going up in the east? Science is really, really relative and pretty much changing with every new discovery.

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  22. Extrospection & all other FTM posters here:

    Talk about a GOD complex you have. I come here to be the BIG MAN to show these poor people how right I am again and again. Nevermind that they have asked me repeatedly again and again not to comment or come here because you (i assume) do consider yourself a man.

    If you are indeed so interested in helping others - go set up your own blog to do just that. Let me assure you that these young kids certainly need no handholding on navigating the internet and can search to find the support they need.

    This blog is for lesbians. If you do as you say and respect lesbian only space, and do not consider yourself a lesbian-LEAVE.

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  23. i never thought this was a 'lesbian only' space (though i am one)- i actually like (well maybe not like exactly) to read what the transists' beliefs are... and if you read extrospection's blog you will see she really does have something like a 'god complex-' like many militant atheists (no i'm not religious)

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  24. ". and for those who don't know any better, if that mis-information goes uncontested then they take ignorant statements as fact."

    Which, of course, includes all the statements you find on the trans side about brain sex and innate gender and all that crap. Or gender as a whole, to be totally frank. Usually met with the usual ignorant --it's a proper medical disorder diagnosed by proper doctors with lots of letters after their names and YEARS of training, therefore it must be true.

    What 'mis-information' do we have here? That T and surgery ain't all wine and roses, and that there MAY BE other alternatives to those having problems with their gender other than -- you're a man.............Such as gender being a whole load of nonsense to start with...........

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  25. well yes 11:30, and Dirt has absoluteness no interest at all in learning and expanding her knowledge, she has an ideology that she is sticking to, anyone who disproves her is only silenced by having their comments deleted.

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  26. "and Dirt has absoluteness no interest at all in learning and expanding her knowledge, she has an ideology that she is sticking to, anyone who disproves her is only silenced by having their comments deleted.
    "

    The classic ole turn criticisms around on the accuser line!

    Having your comments removed from Dirts blog is hardly being silenced, given the wealth of sites where saying exactly the same things will get you tonnes of approval................

    Plus the same ole -- if we were better educated, then we'd ALL agree with the trans cant.

    If you think you can DISPROVE any of this, where is the proof? O, or has it been 'silenced' out of existence? Easy to make claims, harder to make ones that stand up to scrutiny.

    Yep, I've got an ideology, but then so does the trans crowd, I just think mine is a whole lot less harmful, and gives MORE hope to women in the long term, other than the hormones-and-surgery will fix you up no problem line.

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  27. Dyke, ill get back to you another time I'm too tired to argue right now love.

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  28. Alright so, firstly, Dyke, you come here with a lot of baggage, with a “ive heared it all before” attitude, which you use to avoid addressing anything.
    “wooptydoo” isnt an argument, just saying.

    “Plus the same ole -- if we were better educated, then we'd ALL agree with the trans cant.”
    Strawman. I was referring to the actual fallacies dirt blurts out constantly, and her misinterpretations.
    I would list some but this comment would be instantly removed.
    Personally i do not claim to understand WHY trans people are the way they are, I just accept that we simply don't know at this point in time.
    Also for all you know I have written my own blogs about some of the issues raised, but that doesn’t mean I am going to get a response from dirt or her followers, my comments are directly aimed at dirt and other followers of this blog,
    However, I don't think the majority of opinions on this blog are really important enough to write essays over.

    Either way, there is really no reason to delete perfectly acceptable comments. Anything that hurts the credibility of this blog is removed, she will only leave comments that make trans people look like idiots, its the kind of filtering the media would use to push their agenda,


    “ Yep, I've got an ideology, but then so does the trans crowd”
    Note how I was talking about an individual yet you have the audacity to suggest an entire group shares the same ideology, you have no idea at all what I believe and there is a lot of clashing opinions within the trans community.

    People should and do take alternative routes if that is what feels right for them. I have no problem with that, and I'm sure many have taken that route.
    Transition isnt something we (or at least I) take lightly, we have years to think it over and are warned over and over of the implications.
    Ohh and id just like to point out, slighly off topic, that just because trans people read this blog does NOT mean they are unhappy with their lives, as an Atheist, ive visited Christian posts regarding Athiests, doesn't mean I want to become a Christian lol.

    Well that's about it see ya.

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  29. Good luck with your blog/s anon, clearly then there is no reason for you to hang about here. And calling BD "dyke" didnt go unnoticed.

    dirt

    ps Happy transsexual is an oxymoron, its right up there with happy 67 pound anorexics.

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  30. "yet you have the audacity to suggest an entire group shares the same ideology,"

    Because I keep hearing/reading the SAME things on blogs/websites/youtube. Just because there are differences between individuals DOESN'T mean that we can't point out useful and telling similarities. Hence a common ideology.

    Really, this is just useless nit-picking, because it is obvious what I meant, and obvious to anyone that trolls the blogs what I meant.

    "and there is a lot of clashing opinions within the trans community." Yep, I'll admit I'm puzzled by the transsexual/transgender distinction, but that isn't the issue here -- the commonality of ideology amongst the YouTubers IS, despite proestations of 'we're all individuals/we're ALL different' (Life of Brian quote coming on there -- plus I can't resist -- where'e the foetus going to gestate, in a box, and the right to have babies line)

    "Alright so, firstly, Dyke, you come here with a lot of baggage, with a “ive heared it all before” attitude, " Nope -- I point it out when I HAVE come across it before, idetifying commonalities is useful amd you're doing exactly the same thing when you refer to Dirt and the supposed uniformity of her crowd of 'followers'.

    "Dyke, ill get back to you another time I'm too tired to argue right now love." I don't mind the Dyke that muich (just not very USEFUL, loads of dykes on here!), but the love ain't so great, get too much of that from bus drivers!

    "you come here with a lot of baggage" On 'their' side it's knowledge or experience, from our side it's baggage? Or just means, O dearie ME, I've got an opinion and state it quiteb strongly.

    I have to say, previously I wasn't that concerned about trans, it's just my personal experience and discovery of the transtrend and the whole 'you're a guy if you say you are' and brain-sex business that have CHANGED my opinion. My baggage is what is happening to all these women too ashamed to keep their womanhood, whereas from the trans side, we just seem to get -- their choice as individuals, why should you care........

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  31. Dirt, you're not being clever here, happy transsexual is not an oxymoron in its true definition, don't be foolish, i know you're trying to be clever but no, you're just not.
    And stop making assumptions, another one of the "facts" i was talking about, finely demonstrated by the dirt herself, thank you.

    Anyway.

    "you're doing exactly the same thing when you refer to Dirt and the supposed uniformity of her crowd of 'followers”
    Would you like to quote me on that? I'm going to assume you are referring to the following.
    “but that doesn’t mean I am going to get a response from dirt or her followers”
    Of course at this point it does almost sound like I'm talking about a cult, but not 1 sentence later I continue,
    “my comments are directly aimed at dirt and other followers of this blog”
    I hope that made it clear that I was referring to followers of the blog and not some Dirt cult, If I believed all the followers of this blog shared the same ideology, why would I be interested in the perspective of everyone else?

    “Yep, I've got an ideology, but then so does the trans crowd, I just think mine is a whole lot less harmful,”
    It is clear that you are trying to make a connection between myself and an ideology, that you couldn't possibly know if I hold or not,
    This is so that you can act like any valid argument you believe to hold against it you can act like it is a valid argument against me, its all part of the straw man tactic.

    "On 'their' side it's knowledge or experience, from our side it's baggage?"
    This is another straw to the man, I never claimed that a particular side had “knowledge or experience,” im going to assume you are referring to the following.
    “ Dirt has absolutely no interest at all in learning and expanding her knowledge, she has an ideology that she is sticking to”

    Beliefs like.. “Happy transsexual is an oxymoron” no matter how much of a fulfilled life a transman might live, Dirt will never be able to bring herself to believe that he and his family could be happy, not all the evidence in the world, not even a happy-o-meter could convince her.
    Or at least, I believe, she simply couldn’t admit that she does.
    Again I never said that a particular side had more knowledge or experience than the other. I was talking about an individual.
    But up the straw man goes.
    Id like to point out at this time that you are really keen on laying down a line between “us” and “them”.
    To be honest it sounds like you are arguing for the sake of arguing.
    You are trying to force me in to a position that you believe would be easier to attack, a position you are more comfortable in arguing against.
    All you have done is created arguments for me and labelled them as mine.
    You then go and babble on about your opinions that I had no interest in and had little to do with the original discussion.
    I really don't care what your opinion is on such issues at this time, when I want it I will ask for it, but it is somewhat unfitting for this particular conversation.
    I'm really failing to see a point in continuing to arguing with you if you are just going to continue dismantling your own straw man arguments.
    Maybe its best we just leave it at that.
    If im lucky, Dirt wont delete this comment.
    peace.

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  32. "no way, i see SO many trans'men' who are tiny and wide-hipped- i almost think women with the LEAST masculine bodies transition to male more often than people with more androgynous natural looks- the same way so many male-to-females remain towering masculine types with adam's apples dressed in tootsie-attire"

    Well, I appreciate the Tootsie ref, anyway. I've seen some short transguys, I guess. Like I said, I feel kinda bad for them. Before I transitioned, I evaluated what the likely physical outcome would be. Yes, I know that I'm not supposed to say this, but I'm a pragmatist and the last thing I wanted was to not pass. It's physically dangerous, and I'd rather be frustrated than dead. I think you'll find that many of us who pass well are less and less attached to the lesbian community. Some of us proudly id as trans but have little in common with dykes, unless true friendship is involved. Those of us who do not pass well or who are in early stages of transition may cling to queer spaces because they are having a harder time in the outside world. Like I said, I feel bad for them but that's not on me. You aren't even seeing those of us who walk amongst you and pass because you would never guess we were trans. Trust me. And for god's sake, please stop evaluating everyone's ass and body. Did you ever mean to let your anger towards transpeople into the worst kind of male? Because you sound like some of the guys I work with- going around judging others' bodies with no ground to stand on themselves.

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  33. i see so many ftms of all shapes and sizes (mtfs too) because i work around the corner from the LGBT center in NYC so i've learned the traits... it's not only physical features that give them away (though the female eyes never change no matter how many years of T one's taken... until ftm's start having their skulls and eye sockets surgically reconstructed, that will continue to make them obvious to the observant)- it's a certain uncomfortable trying-too-hardness that initially draws my attention

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  34. "I'm really failing to see a point in continuing to arguing with you if you are just going to continue dismantling your own straw man arguments."

    Well, I whole cartload of straw aimed at me there.

    "It is clear that you are trying to make a connection between myself and an ideology, that you couldn't possibly know if I hold or not,"

    I don't CARE what you believe in the depths of your heart, I just NOTICE when what you say links into a common set of pro-trans beliefs that I've come across elsewhere.

    "Id like to point out at this time that you are really keen on laying down a line between “us” and “them”." Because there is this COMMONALITY of belief that I'm trying to argue against. Your response just seems to be -- you don't know what I believe, and we're ALL individuals anyway, hence blah blah blah. Which is just plain ole denial of the commonalities that ARE obvious the more posts you look at on this blog.

    "To be honest it sounds like you are arguing for the sake of arguing." I don't care what it SOUNDS like, if you want to KNOW why I'm arguing, why not ask? I think I've already said on here why I'm concerned, and if you want to CHANGE opinions, you need to understand something about WHY people hold the opinions they do, hence discussion.

    Although I will admit that being a professional scientists DOES pre-dispose me to take a fairly adversarial stance, which some mistake as just arguing for the sake of it............

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  35. looks like dirt deleted my comment, sorry dyke.

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  36. Hey Dirt! out of curiosity, what is your stance on pornography? Thanks!

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  37. Hey Lisa, its all part and parcel of misogyny.

    dirt

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