Change Your World-NOT your Body

Monday, April 25, 2011

Female Transition and Pregnancy

This and the links that follow are of/from an email I received over night, the email can be read above.

First link here.

Second link here.

Be sure to check out the comments, they illustrate the blind extolment the trans community is notorious for regardless of any situation involving a trans person, no matter how dangerous that situation is to the individual or any individuals involved.

The emailer also added another non related link to the group above, but as it is relevant to the subject I'm linking it within this post. Link here.

dirt
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38 comments:

  1. hmm... well as far as that email segment goes, there are low-class family dramas of all stripes i suppose.
    as far as the pregnant 20 year old transman story, what i find strange is how concerned they were about the sex of the baby...

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  2. And absolutely no one in this family questions the effect that all this hormonal crap may have on the baby? Expectant mothers are routinely told to even avoid coffee or coca cola for God's sake. You can't tell me that cycling on and off T before getting pregnant is not a risk factor to both the "mother" (sorry, can't say "father") and the infant.

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  3. Out of the three cases that I'm familiar with where an ftM has made her childs condition known, all three ftMs who gave birth, the child was autistic.

    Given the long belief that autism is a "hyper male" condition, it isnt surprising that a female hooked on "T", who then gets pregnant by a male, would give birth to an autistic child.

    dirt

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  4. Both are FTM.

    http://www.advocate.com/uploadedImages/MOOREXLRG(1).jpg

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  5. You got to be kidding me...
    You want to be seen as "men" but yet you're getting knocked up?

    I don't understand how one can denounce every ounce of their female anatomy but choose to go through the morning sickness and the swollen belly.

    It just shows how female you are. You can't escape it.

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  6. oh gross i just saw their picture
    you can barely tell she's pregnant really, they're both obese

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  7. @Anon 12:08 PM

    Judgmental much??? What is wrong with someone being obese?

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  8. right, obesity is just another great form of body modification !

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  9. I wish them all the best :)

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  10. You know, Dirt. You often make some great points, but, everybody has problems. These problems are not from being trans. These are just fucked up human problems, emailed to you from whom? You discredit your points with stuff like this.

    I am in agreement with you how transitioning supports the dominant gender structure, and that it is misogyny in action. But, it is not individuals choices, it's the group... it's a response to misogyny. Trans folks do not create misogyny.untalin..they are responding to it. In their own way.

    And I agree that it is a fad. But, where did this email come from? How could this be proof of anything, except that humans are fucked up?

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  11. Being trans is not from being trans either.

    dirt

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  12. They're trying to make money and exploit their freak act, while maintaining some wholesome family image. Women having children isn't worthy of the tabloids. We do it all the time. I think before companies pay for pictures and stories, they should do their homework.

    it's not just about fucked up human beings. Its about mentally ill women, posing as men, dragging in strangers from the internet, and exposing their children to their dangerous lifestyle.

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  13. what's wrong with obesity? um it's really unhealthy. it's what is the major problem with why healthcare is so expensive. it's a major problem/concern in the US. not to mention childhood obesity. geez. wake up. obsity is a problem as well.

    we are not meant as humans to have every little thing our little hearts desire. we are meant to be physically active people.

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  14. Yeah but someone shouldn't be making fun of someone saying that you can't tell that a person is pregnant because they are obese. That's just ignorant!

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  15. What's most telling to me in all of their own postings - are where they say how much the personality changes when going off of the T.

    I thought it didn't change you?! We all know what a crock that is.

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  16. FTM pregnancy just makes FTMs look like they want to have their cake and eat it too. It shows how some are confusingly decisive on when to declare their femaleness as valid. Reminds me very much of some FTMs using female spaces. Using strict gender norms until it flexes in a way that you so wish. (<<Can't say that only trans people do that though.)

    Some of the stories listed were just messed up even without the trans element. The last one was more exclusive to trans issues and I found it quite disturbing. He came off more interested in T/GID than the baby.

    Also the pregnant man tabloid crap needs to stop. It's just as bad as the octomom!

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  17. right, obesity is just another great form of body modification !



    too funny!

    Btw, "not making fun of a person who is blind, fat, etc" is not the same as "worshipping blindness, fatness, etc". There's a grand chasm between ridicule and worship -- which is the reason why the "fat acceptance" movement sometimes appears creepy to me. In their haste to get other folks to stop ridiculing obesity, they end up sounding like they're worship fatness.

    Anyway, back on topic. It's almost certain these kids of transparents are going to be seriously nuts. What are they gonna hear 24/7? "Jonnie, you are entitled to get whatever you want, and to hell with other people's rights." These kids are going to be absolute hoodlums.

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  18. If their daughter likes anything other than airy-fairy princess crap, they'll be dragging her to the sex-change doctor poste haste. Even if she's only two years old.

    And when every single transgendered family is pulling this bullshit, is the medical community going to play along? They will be instilling such extreme gender conformity in these kids, that I wonder if their idiocy will be obvious to even themselves?

    "Look honey, Jennifer likes blue pacifiers, she must be a boy. I know, let's start calling her Thomas!"

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  19. "FTM pregnancy just makes FTMs look like they want to have their cake and eat it too."
    that's what Queer is all about,
    nothing means anything
    you can be a pregnant man, a woman with a cock, a kinky heterosexual, anybody who wants to be cool, it all falls under Queer
    'Anything Goes'
    it's just unfortunate that ordinary homosexuals have to be grouped into this mess...

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  20. Hilarious. Have fun being an "ordinary homosexual". Gonna start voting Republican soon? Trying to gain respectability for your group by distancing yourselves from other groups that are also viewed as unnatural and disgusting by the majority of people. Check your history. It never works.

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  21. Dirt, you are shocked by 2 transmales being pregnant and giving birth while on T?
    Me I am simply shocked by the growing trend of transdaddy ie females with a masculinised body who pretend to be the father of their partner's child....

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  22. (i actually feel no need to be a part of a 'group')

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  23. I don't get it.

    I don't get how you can say you're a man and then get pregnant on purpose.

    I don't get how you can think you should be taking care of a kid when you can't even take care of your own body.

    I don't get how you can be totally unconcerned about the effects of your hormones on your reproductive system, or lingering effects on the baby.

    And I *really* don't get why anyone in their circumstances would go to the media and advertise like they're proud of what they're doing.

    And then add in all the family drama gossip, and it just makes my stomach churn.

    I try to compare it to other fucked-up family situations...I know a little girl being raised by a neo-Nazi ex-con and his tweaker girlfriend...but this isn't like that, these people have resources and education, they got pregnant on *purpose* with medical intervention. Insane.

    And these weirdos are out there as the public face of trans men.

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  24. I totally agree with you that FtMs shouldn't have kids that way. And if that e-mail is real, it's disgusting. But I see nothing there. No facts, no sources. At most, a small correlation to being transgender, if the story is real.

    But anyway, as someone who isn't "normal" is it really your or my right to judge their choices? What they appear to be doing to their children is sick, but as for Ftms choosing to have children that way it's within their rights. It's simply impossible to know whether they will be bad or good parents based on one little tiny part of them (although, you could argue that is a significant part of them, and I wouldn't really disagree, but it's really nothing to do with personality).

    Smart parents are good. Are they always good parents? Hell no.

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  25. dirt, I really think you need to take a look at this. Yes, it's cracked. But just check it out. Some obviously don't apply, but...


    http://www.cracked.com/article_18536_the-5-biggest-mistakes-women-like-me21-make-internet.html

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  26. What I find most disturbing on trans forums is how these girls don't even know how their own reproductive systems work. Not to mention, T can damage a female fetus, it's especially damaging in the first 12 weeks...when the mother is unlikely to even know she's pregnant, thinking T is a birth control when it's damn well not.

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  27. ummm there so much controversy surrounding non conforming pregnancies... in my country its becoming increasingly popular for young lesbian couples to become pregnant after only a few months of being in a relationship...

    what is scaring me is the lack of health care REGARDLESS of all predjecies these children could be at risk to serious deformities or diese same with the carrier of the child and there is lack of access to health care in countries that are developed...

    As for the fact their reproductive organs IF they have been on and off "T" then yes they will be fully functional obviously there are potential health issues like thinning of the uterine walls...

    personally i would NEVER carry a child men dont give birth.. in my head it confuses me as to why they would want to do such a thing, but who am i to judge, as long as the child is raised with all the shit it needs....
    really all this is too much for my brain to handle..lol

    also for the person who said something about "T" changing you, you are correct the chemical/hormone is that of a male so your thought pattern and behaviors that of a male...


    OH side note, if that person has been on and of "T" for a number of years it does raise concern for me as that means you in that constant "teenage" state

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  28. I don't understand why you felt the need to include the email. It reads like it was written by a ten year old. Given that it's representative of your own beleifs on the subject, it makes you seem immature and uneducated.

    Funnily enough though, I was in the middle of watching a documentary about this couple when I stopped by here and saw this post. Would have been nice to engage in some intelligent discussion on the matter - but that email tells me it's not worth it. It makes me wonder about the age and maturaty level of the readers of this blog.

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  29. And also, I kind of resent the way some of the commenters have treated the issue of autism. Aspergers especially is EXTREMELY common nowadays. And it's not always a tragedy - it can even be a good thing.

    The boy with aspergers in question was not even concieved by his FTM parent. So there's really no need to bring him into this.

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  30. I've worked with kids with autism/aspergers and 50% of them were FEMALE. Statistically there are more males than females but it certainly isn't a hypermale condition.

    Sorry, I'm done now.

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  31. ^ by hypermale condition, I'm assuming dirt also meant that for a long time, men with aspergers argued that they were superior beings who thought logically like Mr. Spock, unlike normal people who are effemininate, weak, and prone to arguing like Jersey Shore castmates. Because that's what having emotions does to people, especially women. One of the big early antifeminist sites, Backlash.org spent a lot of time extolling the virtues of high functioning autistics and held that it was only a disease because women couldn't handle it.

    -rich

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  32. Asperger's is not "extremely common." The CDC estimates that anywhere from 0.6% to 1.0% of the US population has *any* form of an autism spectrum disorder - that includes everything from Low Functioning Autism to Asperger's. It is true that there is more awareness of the existence of and diversity in autism spectrum disorders now, along with broader definitions of what constitutes an ASD and increased rates of diagnoses. In any case, it is not "extremely common." If it were extremely common, Aspies wouldn't really stand out at all, would they?

    Dirt's reference to the idea that autism is an example of "extreme hyper male brain" is an theory put forth by the prominent autism researcher Simon Baron-Cohen, who says that having a brain more prone to "systemizing" (rather than "empathizing") is "male" and thus, autism is "extreme male brain." Baron-Cohen and his team have theorized that fetuses exposed to higher levels of testosterone can result in the child manifesting behaviors that are more prevalent in autism (they do *not* claim that exposure to higher levels of testosterone in utero *causes* autism).

    Of course, Baron-Cohen's theory has been studied and criticized by others, including Cordelia Fine, who has criticized his position in her latest work, 'Delusions of Gender.' (You can see a response to some of his criticisms here: http://www.cordeliafine.com/Fine_Response_Psychologist_December_2010.pdf) Also here http://escholar.salve.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1016&context=jift and if you have access here: http://escholar.salve.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1016&context=jift

    The idea that autistic people don't empathize and have no emotions is a destructive and false one. Autism is a deficit in the ability to communicate and process, among other things, emotions. People with autism, for example, may speak in a monotone or have a flat affect; many cannot effectively mirror or understand other people's tones of voice, their facial expressions and body language. But reading the work of autistic adults (and teens) shows that there is plenty of genuine emotion present in these minds and hearts. Frankly, I think a lot of "empathy" that people show is exactly that - for show. It's fakey fake, because people say what they *think* they are expected to say, whereas the autistic person says what is genuine to her or him, and not what is necessarily "expected."

    I'm done. :D

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  33. @DD talks alot..

    im in agreeance here with you, any one can have ASD and every single case is different...

    a person i know lives with ASD and they are mid range but they can still work a full time job live a "normal" life and express emotion like everyone else, they just have there own way of expressing it and thats ok...

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  34. again with the male brain talk.

    if you listen to a ton of ftms talk about how after being on T they loose the ability to cry and empathize as easily before this makes me wonder.

    its my belief that these girls want to move away from their 'girlie' brains (ha!) that they seem to have issues with all those intense feelings of what it is to be female?! and would just rather be a systematical male, where they are allowed by our society, if not encouraged- to be more ego-centered and me focused. Along with the extended adolescence that we tend as a society to extend to men.

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  35. Er. Please notice what Dirt actually said. She did not denigrate autism. Hello. What she did say, is that in her experience she noticed that female-TO-tranz tend to have kids with autism at much higher rates than average.

    Autism is not something a reasonable parent would wish for their child, so it seems like this connection does need more scrutiny.

    Also keep in mind, that these females do not naturally have higher levels of testosterone without doing anything to themselves -- they deliberately create this situation. As has been mentioned on this site before, while they do need to take T for the rest of their lives some effects of testostone do not neccessarily "wear off" after the user has stopped. Anyway, if anyone has any links to the effects of higher levels of testosterone on a fetus or a child, it would be greatly appreciated.

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  36. @ m Andrea

    I wasn't referring to what Dirt said, aside from the hyper male statement.

    @ DD talks a lot

    Actually, it's a lot more common than you think. It's a huge spectrum and you can't always tell by looking. A few of my good (female) friends have it and you'd never know.

    And I don't know how you came to interperate the "hyper male" comment in that way, but that's not the feeling I got from it at all. I could be wrong.

    Anyway that's the last I'm going to say on this topic. I could go on and on, but it's pretty irrelevant to the actual post.

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  37. well, males do tend to have much higher rates of certain types of disorders, including autism and fetishes, which could also be a source for that "hyper male" bit. Yes, it's true that doctors don't always diagnose properly in girls, but the males still end up having much higher rates, on average.

    When doctors first started becoming aware of autism, almost ZERO girls were ever diagnosed. They were labled "mentally diasabled", instead.

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  38. They should have children if they want. But they have to be aware that it's very dangerous for the child. Taking T while pregnant is risky. Are there any studies about this?

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