Change Your World-NOT your Body

Thursday, March 31, 2011

The MineField that is the Butch Body

I have written about and mentioned many times how through years of systematic Butch Shame, Butch lesbians become alienated from their/our bodies, especially sexually.  To the Femmes who desire, touch and seek to touch that war torn Butch body, what do you do to navigate the Butch minefields when you make love with a Butch?

To the Butches I ask, what do you do to help your Femme navigate your body so that you both can take pleasure in it during sex?

To everyone else-if you have sexual experiences/romances where one partner suffered from body/sexual shame, feel free to apply the above questions to your situation and leave an answer.




  1. When I first came out, I bought this book on lesbian sex. I think it was called "On Our Backs" if I remember correctly. There was a section on how to have sex with a Butch. It had tips like referring to her breasts as "pecs," keep telling her hot and "manly" she was, and a lot of similar nonsense. Even then, when I barely knew anything about lesbian culture, I thought it was ridiculous and probably did more harm than good.

  2. The 'On Our Backs' book is really sort of a disaster if you desire a non-stone, female ID cutch partner. There's a lot I don't like about it that has nothing to do with that though, too. Why would anyone who loves females think it is a good idea to downplay a butch partner's female characteristics, compare her to a man all the time (especially intimately) like society does, etc? It's part of that erasing femmes as lesbian thing too. You can't say you like *breasts* like any other lesbian, say you like "pecs" and "bits" instead. Ugh.

  3. Many years ago, I used to date an ex-nun. She was quite sweet and smart, but completely unable to accept her own sexuality on any level, much less being a lesbian. We broke up, and just recently I figured out that this situation had a far more negative affect on me than I realized at the time. And that I really went into a numbing profound depression for quite a while. Which lead me to make a lot of bad decisions.

  4. i hope you die, stop breathing my air and wasting it.

  5. Scribe,

    Anything that alienates or helps to further alienate a Butch from their bodies is harmful, and sadly post queer theory, masculinizing Butch women has become the norm.


  6. Anon 10:05
    I'm curious as to why this situation left you in a state of depression? Also was her not "accepting her sexuality" the reason for why you broke up? Just interested if you're willing to elaborate a little more :)

  7. I remember being about 9 or 10 and lusting over a butch woman...never met one; really didn't even know if they existed. So as soon as I was mature enough to have sex and actually met a butch; I knew EXACTLY what to do with their body. I don't think I could even be with a "stone" butch. As a femme.....I think the butch mystique is a beautiful beautiful thing and should NEVER have shame.

  8. I wasn't even aware of the different views a butch may have about her body until a few years ago. Until then, among the few butch women I made out with, I did notice a kind of "freeze up" if I touched them a certain way, so maybe subconciously I avoided women like this, as it made me feel uncomfortable. However, the first and only butch I dated turned into a full blown relationship, and issues about sex, etc. came up. I explained to her how I felt as if my hands were tied during sex, and how I needed to be able to reciprocate. She admitted that lots of women she dated in the past were fine with (and even expected) her not climaxing or recieving foreplay. In the end she went to a sex therapist (alone - I didn't want to make her any more self-conscious than neccessary). The therapist told her to just relax and allow me to do what i do, without aiming for climax. It was frustrating the first few days, but eventually it turned out fine. The best sex I've ever had before or after the relationship, and she said I was the first woman who sexually fulfilled her (which I found sad - she was in her 40's). Anyway, dealing with sexual issues with a butch (IMO)is similar to anyone else. Love, patience, and (if needed) a few sessions with a good sex therapist.

    1. Would you mind having a very anonymous convo by email about this? NOT a pickup. Just dont wanna hog the thread and yours is the only experience I have seen anywhere that mirrors mine.

      mozkcreations At gmail.


  9. I'm so glad to be with a Butch partner without these hangups..and to be Butch myself without too many hangups either. We both value our orgasms, in slightly different ways, but because we are Butch on Butch we are determined to give as much attention as needed so we can both achieve what we need and want...we definitely ARE NOT stone butches, neither could we date them for any length of time and thrive....I can't help but think of stones as damaged in some way to not allow basic touch. Even guys want to be touched and satisfied by their women.

    We also affirm each other's bodies fully, breasts, yoni(vagina), skin, lips, ect. and that is very empowering.

    There are ways to approach Butches sexually, still honor them as both womyn and as Butches without making them feel like they're being fucked 'like a girl', all you have to do is listen to us, and hear what we're saying in the ways we want to be approached where we don't feel demeaned. Many Butches have felt that way when we/they were with men, for those who were, and did not understand either themselves, nor were understood, and NEVER want to experience that kind of humilation this is why some may come out as 'stone' thinking that's what it's all about to be Butch.

    It took me many years to fully accept my desires, and all the myriad aspects of my Butch Dyke sexuality. And to find a partner who feels similarly without a whole lot of hangups about her body either....we are PROUD of our breasts and our Yonis, and we love the pleasure we can feel from them...there is no reason to feel shame with our Female bodies, and refer to breasts as 'pecs' or ignore our multi orgasmic cunts....we're cunt loving womyn!!!

    But it takes time, and affirming partners to help one do so, whether that partner to a Butch is either another Butch or a Femme.

  10. Too bad there aren't more comments on this thread. I'd be interested to hear more perspectives.

  11. i'm just discovering myself that i have what is called vaginismus- definition: which is is the German name for a condition which affects a woman's ability to engage in any form of vaginal penetration, including sexual intercourse, insertion of tampons, and the penetration involved in gynecological examinations. This is the result of a reflex of the pubococcygeus muscle, which is sometimes referred to as the "PC muscle". The reflex causes the muscles in the vagina to tense suddenly, which makes any kind of vaginal penetration—including sexual intercourse—painful or impossible.

    A woman suffering from vaginismus does not consciously control the spasm. The vaginismic reflex can be compared to the response of the eye shutting when an object comes towards it. The severity of vaginismus and the pain during penetration, including sexual penetration, varies from woman to woman.
    its a common condition in women who have been shamed about their vaginas, and women who have suffered sexual abuse.

  12. wow...this link is (now) officially dead.

  13. When you were with a butch woman, how did you get her to relax during sex? I'm a butch woman and I have a hard time relaxing. I'm 29, and I've never had sex with anyone before. I want to, but I'm afraid that if someone tries to make love to me, that my body won't react the way I want it to. I'm afraid of disappointing her. I have a hard time "getting there" myself half the time. And when I do, my orgasms are really weak. I guess I figured that if I have a hard time "getting there" by myself, how is someone else going to? What are some of the main reasons why butch women have a hard time relaxing when being made love to?

  14. Gosh. I need more of this thread. Outoftheloops experience is odentical to my (ashamed) butch girl except mine would die before seeing a sex therapist. I am a mostly femme but I have a dom side and we all want to satisfy our partners. This has been very painful for us both. I have withdrawn bc I feel so out of my elemant.


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