Change Your World-NOT your Body

Tuesday, September 7, 2010

Gay Transmen and the "right" to be in Gay Male Spaces
























 
This OKCupid gay trans(man) profile post was linked in a recent comment. (note: she list herself as "bisexual")

This trans attitude is the same attitude lesbians have received from (bi) straight females since the B attached itself to the gay and lesbian movement. It is a privileged attitude demanding we (gays and lesbians) alter our lives, our loves, and our NATURAL attractions for others. And when we do not, when we declare, celebrate and shout at the tops of our proud lungs, we love gay men or we love lesbians, the trans community's first reaction is to call us TRANSPHOBIC because our attractions and loves do not include them! And why would it? Would I suddenly be attracted to a man whose penis was torn off in an accident? Of course not, because he isnt the sum of his parts, he is the sum of his nature, his womb developed born nature!

And there isnt any accident, any drugs, and cosmetic surgeries or any amount of make up and heels that's going to change that! Having a gay brother and a gay best friend, I cant tell you right now, as gay men they do not have a problem with men with small penis's, they do however have a problem dating FEMALES! They will fuck a female in desperate times, but they arent going to fall madly in love with one, regardless of her superficial masculine state and they certainly arent going to desire spending the rest of their gay lives with a female. Again, that doesnt make them "transphobic", what it makes them is GAY!

How fucking dare this person demand "respect" from the gay community when she clearly does not respect the gay community herself!!!!!!! Utter BULLSHIT! And the trans community can come on here and say "well that just one persons view", but as someone whose VERY familiar with what goes on and gets said behind the trans fence, this one trans(man) is a drop in the gay trans(male) bucket regarding their attitude and disrespect of the gay and lesbian community!

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15 comments:

  1. EXACTLY. If you weren't born in a male body, then NO amount of surgeries and drugs and theorizing can make you the same as a man. Men and their lives are more than just the things that surgeons and doctors and academics can help you sorta fake.

    If you weren't born in a woman body, then NO amount of surgeries and drugs and theorizing is going to make you the same as a woman. Women and their lives are ALSO more than just the things that surgeons and doctors and academics can help you sorta fake.

    Instead, if you do surgeries and drugs and theories, what you've made yourself is a man or a woman who's altered brain chemistry and body-look in an attempt to appear more like the opposite sex. If men are one thing, and woman are another thing, then you've made yourself into a THIRD thing - something completely outside the lives and experience not only of your own born-sex but also still of the opposite sex you are trying to fake.

    If people recognize that, and refuse to play pretend with you, that's not oppression. It's real life.

    That's just how it works. Most people don't want to be rude, so they just ignore the reality of what you've done to yourself. But if you try to push that "thirdness" into their lives as if you are the same, OF COURSE they are saying buzz off.

    I do too.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Second Anon regarding the vids,

    Obviously they dont "pass" as male, clearly two dykes on "T".

    But whether they "pass" or not isnt the issue, the issue is, they are two dykes trying to co-opt gay male identity, rather than accept the fact that they are two dykes on "T".

    Delusional sadly doesnt even begin to cover it.

    dirt

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  3. And FTM do engage with a higher prevalence in high HIV risk behavior...see the whole report here: http://www.slideshare.net/FrancoisFilletteBerdougo/estimating-hiv-prevalence-and-risk-behaviors-of-transgender-persons-in-the-united-states-a-systematic-review

    ReplyDelete
  4. And once again it comes down to this:

    If you decide to make yourself "trans" in any way, then go be with other "trans" people in the *trans* community, and stop defecating on the lesbian community, and stop trying to push your way into the straight and gay male community. The "trans" community will be where there are people with your life experience, values, and so on, and they alone will "get" (or even *want*) what you think you want.

    FTM does not equal "male", it equals bio-woman who's trying to fake being bio-male.

    And FTM attracted to bio-males does not equal "gay male", it equals "straight woman trying to fake being male" (assuming that the FTM *started* as a straight woman; if she started as a lesbian, then she's now a "lesbian under the influence of mind-altering pharmaceuticals that have done what no other science or religion has ever been able to do: make her believe her sexual orientation has changed").

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  5. "Gay" Transguys are just straight women who likes being sodomised and want to look cool by taking hormons.

    Gay bio male who fuck them are just (in the closet) bisexual top/dom who like to fuck every hole they find on their way...
    A real 100% gay bio male will not fuck those women on hormon and will prefer a bio guy with a dick...

    Being fucked by those top/dom gay bio male is not a validation of the "gayness" of those transguy, it is just a validation they have two warm holes and are submissive/bottom because they lack the dick to be top....

    It is just a submission to a male hierarchy...

    ReplyDelete
  6. "under the influence of mind-altering pharmaceuticals that have done what no other science or religion has ever been able to do: make her believe her sexual orientation has changed"

    That's SO true!! That's the same thing with mtf's. But you will never hear this truth on a ftm website.

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  7. Well Elzi, you'll hear/see the truth here!

    dirt

    ReplyDelete
  8. Just when you think you've heard it all! No one has a right to sexual access to groups whose attraction is to people of the SAME SEX. Let's get real here.

    I cannot imagine being attracted to an MTF, when there are so many wonderful lesbians out there.

    ReplyDelete
  9. Those FTM are digging their own social grave...
    In the future, I sense a lot of bio only spaces will open in reaction to this trans oppression to invade private spaces/bar/parties not intented at them...Either to have only bio gay male at gay place or to have bio L women at L places (and stop admitting "women on T").

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  10. @ Dirt: is there a post on your blog about HIV and transguy ?
    Is there any study focusing on bisexual FTM and the fact they may be a std/hiv vector in the L community by infecting their "lesbian" partner ?

    Also, your blog is super rich in ecducation materials, information & content and sometimes I want to refer to for questioning friends and would like to show specific posts so is it possible to have a tag cloud in the right column ? Thanks !

    ReplyDelete
  11. Yeah, and we have a right to be respected too: AS DYKES. We have a right to not have FTM's force themselves on the Dyke community and Dyke spaces/parties/sexual or other events that are by and for US, as in "Women and Trans" parties while they profess their love for gay men, males and other FTM's and STILL in women's space.

    We have the right to not have the formerly male(which even some straight/bi women recognize AS MALE, along with other bio males)MTF's force themselves into our dyke/women's/sexual, social spaces and identities while having treated women as a whole as 'less than' all their lives because they lived as male, and now want to slum with the lesbos.

    Gay men are also speaking up now that the inundation from the trans movement is being forced upon them. For years they didn't want those who basically considered themselves women/highly effeminate, MTF's or dragqueens as partners, except for the more macho ones or bisexuals or closet cases, so the MTF's mostly date bi men, or gay men who are attracted to such, and now the gay men are being inundated by penisless FTM's many of whom are themselves are incredibly effeminate/female, and look like baby butches with beards or male attitudes without the equipment. Now, they are understanding the depth of violation we have experienced at the hands of the droves of MTF's who INSIST on their presence in the dyke communities, with or without their former flesh penises, their male frames and 6 foot tall plus in heels and platinum blonde hair, in NO WAY passing or even assimilating into dyke culture.

    Let the trans be with each other, FTM's with FTM's and their delusions, MTF's with MTF's or for those more into the polarities, FTM's and MTF's or with bisexual folk who can incorporate both sexes/permutations. But dont' force yourself on the GAY or LESBIAN/Dyke communities that KNOW there is an integrity to the body that comes through the magic of sharing mysteries of womonhood(whether butch or femme) or manhood(whether butch or femme or androgynous) FROM BIRTH. WE KNOW THE DIFFERENCE, and YOU ARE NOT FOOLING US ANY LONGER!!!
    -MasterAmazon

    ReplyDelete
  12. Reposting an Anon comment sans real (chosen) names:

    Trans gay males are a fraud.

    Being a gay transFTM is supposed to be the ultimate magic wand trick but it fails because the main tool is missing.

    Look at this 2 women who do not pass as males but make pathetic attempt to define themselves as a couple of gay males.
    They even got married but on the wedding picture, you can see 2 women not 2 gay males. They dont pass: http://sfquppsala.wordpress.com/2010/08/04/i-do/ and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ecdeOk-gGac

    ReplyDelete
  13. Part I

    I'll start my letter apologizing for anyone in the world that can hurt you or any other women, straight, bi or lesbian, any age, any kind of look, it doesn't matter, anyone of you deserve it. And also I have to state that language is not my first language, so sorry if I have any mistake at this message.

    You seem to be a very intelligent person, you're very articulated, and have a great inner strenght, which is also very important to overcome the so many obstacles of life, please we don't have to fight hate with hate, because that only creates more hate.

    It's so wrong (for so many reasons) that you're receiving so much hate from this guys, as you say they must be confused, but I don't think is due to their identity, I think is due that they have been attacked so many times and again, repeteadly, that at one point they see the enemy is all around; and you're not the enemy you're just stating your point of view, you aren't attacking them at their houses, you are just saying your point of view which it is absolutely valid for you and for some other people, and as I said before they don't have to fight you or hack your page, cause they need to know who they are don't matter what someone else said.

    Besides I have to make clear that I'm not excusing myself because I have said and done so many incorrect things in all my life and so many people have felt attacked and they didn't deserve it (for example I used to go into cinema without doing the line to buy the tickets when I was very young, that was unfear and wrong for some other people), never something that was gender related but yes I have done and said thing that are incorrect cause I haven't take my time to analyze what I was doing wrong.

    In my case (I don't say that I'm an universal law, cause anybody is, is just my particular experience) never have feel like I "have to be" a men, cause hey! I can't be who I'm already I'm, I never feel particularly masculine or anything like that, I just knew who I was even when I didn't have the words to express it.

    And also as you say there's nothing wrong with being a women, matter in fact, being a women could be great, as long as you are one, and that was the thing with me: I never could be a women (I'm not basing on patriarchal -as you said- stupidities of what a women is suppossed to be) because I never was one, for example at some point of my life I try to fake being a women, not even following those wrong ideas that girls are pink and all that, I tried to felt that way but I never could feel it, cause there was something in me that screamed even without words who I was, and that was being a men, who I am.

    Also as you stated being a top doesn't have anything to do with being male or something, that's just the way you like to be in bed, there are heterosexual womens that I could define as tops, they are the active one in the relationship, and that's valid. About short hair or masculine clothes or "butchies look" that doesn't have anything to do with being a men, commonly we see some great womens like Demi Moore, Sinead O Connor, Charlize Theron (and so many others) have had short hair and have weared men inspired clothing, but they look great and with the same energy of a women. For example I tried to use "women designed clothing" (as you say that doesn't have anything to do with being a women, is just clothing, period) and the thing is that I never stopped of being a male, doesn't matter which clothes I wear...

    ReplyDelete
  14. Part 2

    I don't doubt that so many people who think is trans, is not trans, but for me accepting me doesn't mean trying to be a women, for me accepting was and is to know who I'm and don't hiding it, you'll see I grow up in a house when being a women was the best and if you were a men you would be annulated, and the thing is that I tried to be as much as I can a women, cause I saw my mother and she was and is so beautiful (and not just beautiful: independent and intelligent), my grandmother was so strong and the boss of the family, that being a men looked like the worst thing that ever could have happened to you, and I still tried and tried desperatly to be a women, I never was terrorize for girl or anything, matter in fact I think they're beautiful, I don't understand them very well but that doesn't mean that I fear them or anything like that, but I just know I'm not like them, I have had always this unexplicable security that I was a men, I don't even know how I got this inner security of who I am, I just have it.

    I have never though that womens are languid or delicates, matter in fact I think that womens are the real warriors, cause for me they are who have settle history in so many times, in times when being silenced and opressed have been the rule you have fighted so well.

    Matter in fact I have identificate with some womens, not with alls, some, I have had women an men role models; there are some girls that are raised by their fathers and that doesn't mean they're least of a women, they're as much as a women as any other that has been raised for womens, or for a father and mother figure, it doesn't matter at the end of the day, cause they know who they are, and that's what matters: knowing who we are, I know that I'm a men, but I don't need someone buy who I'm, cause I'm not a product for the selling.

    And what I don't like about some trans celebrities is that they're fighting to get in people minds, you know not everybody is going to get who we are, don't matter if you're a women, a men, old or young, any color of skin, not always everybody is going to get us and we can't put our identity agressively into their lifes, if someone can't understand us, that doesn't matter at the end of the day what matters is being happy.

    In my opinion womens and mens can have so much in common, if just they decide to look at their similarities instead of having to fight because of their dicotomies, I think that what we need is to celebrate and embrace our differences and look more at the similarities to fight against what are the real problems in the world: famines, people in pain, the planet suffering the indolence of humanity, those are real problems, not identity, nor religion, cause those things are for ourselves, not to rub in some other people eyes...

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  15. Part 3

    You and so many womens prove that being a women is not being weak instead is about being powerfull in a world that have wanted so many times to take your place in the world and I have to agree with you on that (in fact I have to agree with you in so many stuff), for me a women is not about pink bows; it's about the sense, knowledge and perfect inner security of being, same as being a men. Women and Men in history have prove to be both enough capable of create beautifulness and harmony or instead of being cruel and destroy everything. Both women and men have prove that goodness or evilness, strenghness or weakness is does not resides on those facts, cause it's a matter of character and actions. How Samson died? It was in the hands of a beautiful women, and not just beautiful, intelligent also (matter in fact I'm very mad at the fact of how that character -Delilah- has been portrayed, she wasn't mean or something, she knew how to use her power and very well, she was gorgeous but also witty and she knew it).

    One of the things that I don't get very well is that you're just talking about ftm, what about womens whose conditions happens to be trans? They are not least of a women, they know that being a women is right for them cause that's what they have always been.

    Peace and so many blessings!

    PD. I know I have forgot so many stuff, but I hope you and other people can read this letter, it doesn't matter if some people doesn't think alike, because that's not what communication is about, is about sharing thoughs. I've never liked to use the term "pass" cause we can't not "pass" for who we already are.

    ReplyDelete

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